An AV and integration-focused podcast broadcast weekly

This week's episode of Automation Unplugged our guest today is Kris Coleman, Executive Director of Fox Bravo Overland and CEO of Red5 Security.

Before founding Red5, Kris served as a Special Agent with the FBI and an Intelligence Officer with the CIA. Today, he leads a firm that provides high-level security solutions to families, executives, and corporations, helping them manage everything from physical threats to digital vulnerabilities.

He’s also the driving force behind Fox Bravo Overland, a nonprofit using overlanding expeditions to support veterans and first responders as they reconnect with purpose, community, and themselves.

About this episode:

In this episode, Kris and I discussed:

• How Red5 helps clients navigate security in an increasingly connected and vulnerable world
• Why smart home tech and AI-powered devices are reshaping the threat landscape
• And the mission behind Fox Bravo Overland and its impact on the lives of those who serve

SEE ALSO: #334: Building Partnerships That Shine — Kayla Steinberg of ADI | Snap One

Transcript

Ron:

Hello. Hello there. Ron Callis with another episode of Automation Unplugged. I have an exciting one for you today. I have a returning guest and, , the, this individual, , is a, is a good friend. He's, , he has one of the cooler jobs of anyone that I know in any industry. And, , when I say cool, , I've, I personally have never been in the military. I, , have only, you know, fired a weapon a few times in my life. , but this individual has had a career in security, in protection, in intelligence. , has, , in fact, , been a, , an intelligence officer with the CIA, has been a special agent with the FBI. , he is the CEO of Red five Security, and he is also the executive director of the philanthropy, , the, the, the special project that we'll be talking about today as well called Fox Bravo, Overland. And so I'm, I'm very excited to bring back Chris Coleman onto this podcast. And, , when I bring him in, I'll remind you all of how I, how I know Chris and kind of how we, we, we met each other many years ago. And, , he's one of those people I've certainly made a point to stay in touch with. And, , he's, he's well connected, he is well informed, and, , you know, if you think about your network in life matters, then Chris has been somebody that I've always wanted to have in my network from the moment, that moment that I met him. And, , so lemme go ahead and, and bring him on and we'll see, see how he's doing. Chris, how are you sir?

Kris:

Hey Ron. I'm doing great. Thank you.

Ron:

Awesome, awesome. , so well, first of all, I see mountains in your background. I'm assuming that's a virtual background, unless, are you, are you really in the mountains right now?

Kris:

I wish I was there. , not in the mountains right now, but, , aspiring to be there shortly. Couple weeks.

Ron:

A couple weeks. Okay. , so where are you coming to us from for this interview? , Wisconsin Lake. Michigan.

Ron:

Lake Michigan. Yeah. Awesome. , for those that do not Well, I, I told everyone in the intro there that I would, I would share how you and I met each other. Um, many of our listeners know that when Firefly was actually formed, , back in 2007 as a design and engineering consultancy. And, , in those early years, we not only did design work for on behalf of integrators across the country and around the world, we also started taking on more and more direct consultations where we were the technology contractor, we were the technology design consultant, right on, , what became just an ever escalating level of high net worth, you know, projects, , around the world. And, , it was awesome experience. , we, we enjoyed the process and the pro, , the, the type of work that we did. Um, and that is actually on one of those big projects down in Florida where you and I crossed paths. Yeah. And, and you were the technology consultant, or no, you were the security consultant right. On that project. So maybe with that kind of setup, what is Red Five? Mm-hmm. , red Five Security. Tell, tell us just a little bit about that business and maybe your role in that business.

Kris:

Yeah, so flashing back brace yourself, that was 2011. , you know,

Kris:

it's, oh my gosh, we,

Ron:

we've been around the block a few times. Yeah,

Kris:

exactly. , yeah. Red Five Security started in 2004. After, after having been in the FBI and the CIA, I wanted to start my own business. , wanted to really focus heavily on, on how I could transfer those skills and those experiences from those agencies and those national security concerns to the private sector. And I was fortunate enough to, to be able to, to set up Red five, get running, pick up a number of clients relatively quickly, , high impact clients, high quality clients. Um, and so we started out 2004. We've been running nesses, we just started our 22nd year, but we focus heavily on, um, enterprise security and families and family security. And so we've evolved over the 22 years. We've done a variety of things, , but kicking off back in 2004, up to about that 20. 2015 level. It was a lot of consulting. It was design work, it was helping assess and drive, you know, what was, at the time when you were doing the design work, we would give you the basis of design and why you had to do certain things in the technology. And then teams like yours would, would then design it and then put it to work. And so we were assessing it. We're looking at threats, vulnerabilities and risk creating, creating what the, , the mechanism needed to be, the security program, if you will. People process technology that needed to be deployed to protect the family, protect the corporation. And then it was that sort of synergy with, , vendors that really, , made the secret sauce, right? We had to work closely with the integrators, the vendors, , staffing, , organizations, um, and the families, chiefs of staff, heads of household, , state managers, et cetera. And then on the corporate side, more like the CEOs, the heads of security, CSOs. , what,

Ron:

what type of, , just so that our, our listeners have an idea of the Red Five Security Organization, you know, because, , what you are not, and I'm not saying it's good or bad, but I'm just trying to differentiate what you are not, is you're not a security company that, , you know, there's lots of security contractors around the, around the world, around, you know, the, the marketplace and they, you, you go to them and they put in your security system and your surveillance system. That's not what you guys do.

Kris:

That's right.

Ron:

Tell us a little bit about the structure or makeup of your company. What type of people and experts and capabilities do you guys have?

Kris:

No, I, yeah, I appreciate that. And the, and the industry is, there's a lot of different animals in the industry, right? There's alarm companies, there are monitoring companies, guard companies, executive protection investigations, et cetera. Over the course of the 22 years, we've done all of it. I mean, we just have pivoted to where the clients need had a need. And that could be for a couple of years. It could be a for, for whatever period of time. But what we do now is we do both special projects and we do managed services. So clients come to us and like, I am building a new home and the Caribbean and I need a security system, and can you help us do that? It's a special project. And the answer is typically yes, but we would want to make sure that you have a persistent security experience after the building of the house. So then that leads us to the managed services side of the business, and we would then start helping them with monitoring for threats. We would help them, we're reducing privacy risk for them, , reducing their online profile, making sure they're less of an attractive target, , or the opposite can happen. They can come to us and say, have a. I'm getting attacked online on a regular basis. How can you help me reduce my online profile? How can you help me with, um, understanding of the threats that are out there, , in social media, et cetera, where you would engage with them in a managed managed services contract to help address all of those digitally adjacent and digital threats. And, , we do intelligence analysis and threat assessments and get into all that work. And then we built trust with the client and the relationship is, is growing. Um, and then at some point in time, there's always gonna be a life change, right? I've gotten married, I'm having my first child, I'm building a second house. I've sold the business. All those life stages create risk. And then we're the partner. We're the partner. That's with the CEO, that's with the family. Patriarch and matriarch. And then we, we usually are very sticky, , with our clients because of the trust that we transact in, develop and transact in with all of our clients, both corporate and, and family.

Ron:

To connect it to the technology contracting business. Yeah. Is there typically an AV or automation technology contractor, , in your client's lives, whether enterprise or high net worth? , always. And customer,

Kris:

yeah. Always. We are almost always operating in and around. If it's corporate, there's always an element of, you know, , information technology or cyber. Mm-hmm. , and then on the family side, oftentimes there is some sort of an av it integrator, , low voltage, , that sort of, um, what's the owner experience in the home kind of thinking, you know? Sure. So what are all those apparatus and, and different systems that are built into a residence? Um, and then how does that perhaps apply across multiple residences? , some of these families, you know, in different continents, they've got a number of different homes and. What we hear often is like, please help us understand and develop a system where we have the same interface at every home and, and not a different remote and a different experience and a different, , technology, if you will, , from home to home. So we, we oftentimes are brought in to help make sure that's consistent. And then with that comes a, a consistent level of security that's expected. You know, we don't want one home to be highly secure the next home to be wi wide open. Um, bad guys don't, you know, for example, ignore the fact that there's a house that's that's wide open and, and just, oh, I'm not gonna go to the secure house. I'm gonna go where it's weak. We want all of those homes and residences to be secure at the similar level of, of, , technology and people and process. And that's the experience they're expecting.

Ron:

I'm curious, like what determines the and and what I'm about to ask might be a hard question, but if anybody could answer it, you're the guy, right? What makes for a vulnerable target? IE what level of net worth is it, or what characteristic is it about who they are or how they present that they identify to you and your team as someone that probably needs help or assistance or guidance versus someone that doesn't?

Kris:

Yeah, it's a great question and it's off one we often get, right? So we spend a lot of time doing myth busting, right? My favorite is, you know, I'm worth $10 million or whatever, but no one knows who I am. I'm like, everybody knows who you are. Like let's, let's do the myth bust on that one right now. Like, you're a $10 million, you're a hundred million dollar, you're a billion dollar family. Everyone knows who you are. The internet is now persistent enough that you can't really fly under the radar. Yeah. So we bust that. The vulnerability element is, so if you start with what you're trying to protect, so the assets you're trying to protect, the family members information. It might be artwork, it might be whatever, right? The, the assets you're protecting, what are the threats against those assets? Like is it, is it , vandalism? Is it theft? Is it stealing of, of, , financial, you know, instruments? Is it do, is it cash? Is it artwork? What is it? Are they trying to hurt your family? You know, is it a kidnapping? Is it some kind of violence? We see a lot of this in the crypto space, right? They're trying to get to the, , the crypto space. There's

Ron:

been some notable crypto personalities

Kris:

Oh, yeah. That

Ron:

have talked very openly about their role and either building their wealth in crypto or maybe their executives in crypto company one's coming to mind. I know one happened in Europe not too long ago. Yeah,

Kris:

exactly. And, , they just, they were grabbed and, , families threatened.

Kris:

It's a, it's a, it's a tragic thing, especially when it goes sideways, but it is a very, , descriptive, , scenario around what I'm talking about. So they have the assets, threats are trying to steal those assets, and there's a massive vulnerability with a lot of the crypto, , investors and that they're carrying around, you know, the wallet on their person and, or they're putting it somewhere and say, oh, well I've, I've hidden it somewhere. These, these elements. , of perceived security around, oh, my wallet's here. I'm hiding it, I'm keeping it on my person. Those aren't security. Those aren't good security practices, let's put it that way. So those are, because they are not good security practices, they are vulnerabilities, right? So they are actually creating vulnerabilities for themselves. A lot of instances a family decides not to put in a security system, right? Massive vulnerability. They are not controlling their social media, they're not controlling their privacy settings and all their devices, big vulnerabilities. And so you can see, if you start thinking about the work it takes to secure a family or a residence or a lifestyle, the work that it takes to do that. And then the other side of the spectrum, the ease at which it would be to just not worry about it, right? And have maximum. Isn't that where convenience most

Ron:

of these people live, is it's, they just abdicate the responsibility's. The thinking about it,

Kris:

it's the spectrum, right? So you either can have a maximum convenience. No security and high vulnerability or you can be on the other end of the spectrum and you can have a lockdown life which is secure and maybe you don't have a really good time 'cause it's just too secure. So our role as Red five security is to come in and then understand that spectrum of threat, vulnerability, and risk. Give them information to make good decisions and they can help us find their spot in that spectrum that fits their lifestyle. Is secure enough, not overly secure, right? But is also not wildly vulnerable so that, you know, the child gets kidnapped or they, they do take control of the family for the crypto or , maybe they take over all their devices and now it's a massive hacking effort that disrupts their life. So we are trying to find that sweet spot, and that is an art that is far more of an art than it is a science. But having done this as long as we have, I think we do a really good job of that.

Ron:

And, and your just dive in a little bit to how you work with the customer. Do, do you have like a se I'm gonna make up a term, you'll tell me what the real term is? Sure. Do you have like a security manager from your business that gets attached to the family and then they leverage the resources in within your team? Again, the marketing world, which, you know, we, we, we've left the technology contracting space and design space. We, we do the marketing for these technology contractors around the world. And, , and, and when Firefly land, , ultimately a customer is assigned an account manager,

Kris:

right?

Ron:

An account manager becomes their human. There might be 10 people working on their team, but they generally, we try to keep that interface clean and simple. , what's the equivalent on your side?

Kris:

Very similar. I mean, it, it is a, it is a consultative role. It's an advisory role. Um, internally it's a project management kind of role. So someone is speaking with one. Sometimes, depending on how big the client is, you might have to have two, um, voices, like one talking to intelligence and analysis and one, speaking about operational executive protection and travel. They're just two diff different disciplines, perhaps at two different degrees in the, in the organization, the family of the enterprise. But we try to speak with one voice to the client. , and, you know, families are very unique. Corporations have a more of a, a rigor in their structure that, that we can follow and follow into a chain of command, if you will. Families, it's kind of a, it comes at you, right? So it's, , the matriarch, the patriarch, , the estate manager, whoever's got, you know, that that voice for the family, , will come at you with taskings and you've gotta be, , a bit of a hockey goalie, right? To, to handle all of it coming at you from different angles. Um, but yeah, and it's, and it's, it's key that we find those vendors that we can trust when we do these projects, right? Because now I'm bringing in my reputation to solve this very large, holistic problem of physical and digital and operational challenges. And now I've gotta bring a technology partner or two to the party to help deliver these services at the level that we would expect and, and overdeliver for the family or for the corporation. And so that's, that's sort of our constant. , sort of persistent effort on our end is like, who is, who is on their game? Who is staying ahead of the technology? Who, who knows when, when this new flashy device that's out there in industry is a, is a, a reach, right? It's not proven. Let's not bring this to the house. Let's, this piece of tech

Ron:

could bring a security vulnerability into the home through the network. Yep.

Ron:

If it hasn't properly been vetted, and I'm gonna imagine many integrators probably maybe aren't thinking about that or they're not thinking about their solutions or technology from that perspective.

Kris:

That's correct. Yeah. Two angles there. One is, it's too new, it's not proven right. And there's a lot of the AI stuff right now, which is like, oh, I've got AI enabled cameras and I've got AI enabled this and I've got AI enabled that. And they're like, you know what? Half of that stuff is not proven out. It's, it may be good, it may do certain things. Well, we don't, don't really have enough data on that. Um, and then the other element of that is they're, they're bringing technology to the table that may be vulnerable, may have its own backdoor, may have its own challenge, and they're trying to save the client money. That these cameras are good enough to achieve the goal, but the reality is they've gone too cheap.

Ron:

I, so I'm gonna ask you, is the concept of, , and, and I've, I'm not gonna be derogatory in this statement, but I've just, I've heard it on Twitter, I've heard it, you know, in the media. Is the idea of like a Chinese backdoor in certain cameras or security systems, is that a real thing?

Kris:

It's a, it's a, it's a dramatically presented concept. Like, oh, it's a Chinese backdoor, right? It could be a backdoor for any intelligence service. Um, but yes, I mean, there are vulnerabilities that may be just left there purposefully so that organizations could, could, , take advantage of those over time. And we, we flag those, there's a black, there's a, , black list that US government won't allow technology to be used in their facilities. And we oftentimes follow that because they're gonna be tip of the spear on, on who's doing what and, and what's vulnerable. So we'll follow that as a best. Best practice, if you will, and make sure our families know that, no, we don't want to use those kinds of cameras or those kinds of sensors because they have this kind of a built-in vulnerability. And a lot of them are not aware of that, and they appreciate the fact that, you know, the, the vendor may be doing its best to be, bring optimal value at a, at a low cost. But is that low cost worth the vulnerability you're placing on your family? And depending on the, the political perhaps, , positioning of the family, the role they play in society, that is a vulnerability that's not acceptable. Some of our clients are like, we don't care. Like, tell me why I should care. I'm like, all right, that's a, that's a choice and a trade off that we are gonna talk about. But most of them are like, yeah, I don't need anybody, you know, looking at my pool cameras or, you know, the cameras that lead up to my house and see all my guests coming in, you know, for a party or an event. So, , privacy is becoming more and more the thing we focus on.

Ron:

That's interesting. How, how Chris do you, within the Red Five business, how are you typically meeting or becoming aware of the technology contractor option out there? Some of them listening to the show right now or watching the show?

Kris:

Yeah, I mean, we we're looking for, , best in, you know, region, best in class technology. We know that the states all, all, you know, um, govern, , some of these installation practices in their own ways. If different, different licensing in different states. We see a lot of balkanization of the industry in some ways. You know, they're licensed in five states, but not all 50. They're licensed in these two because they wanna do Mid-Atlantic or whatever it is. Um, so we're looking for regional. Partners that are really, really good. Um, we also have a couple that are very creative in how they tackle that problem. Like they are best in class. They do really, really high end, , installations and then maintenance and support operations afterward. But they've partnered locally so they could be more national. But the piece that's governed right is actually done by another, a second vendor that does, pulls the wire, hangs the camera, but the design programming, , operations of the system are maybe done by a very high end integrator that's, you know, that's out of California or New York or someplace that, um, they found a creative way to sort of hack the industry and tackle it that way. So we're looking for integrators that have got. High net worth experience around estates, specifically estates with a high security need, um, complex environments. I mean, another one we worked on had environmental issues around the beach. Like we couldn't project light onto the beach or the turtles would go the wrong way. And, and that's all really important stuff and you have to be that, that aware of an integrator, a dealer. A vendor so that you can speak smartly. When that, when that CEO says, why are we doing this with this camera? You've gotta be on top of the game, right? You gotta be able to speak to those issues. And then we're looking to be a partner with those, with those integrators. That's really our role is to be sort of the, we're the general contractor of risk management, and then we work very closely with all the different, , vendors. On, on a given would,

Ron:

would, we, would, would you want people that want to be aligned with your projects reaching out to you via your website or reaching out to you directly? Like what would be a, a preferred method or mechanism for you? Yeah,

Kris:

website's good. , come in through the website and look to partner with, you know, say, Hey, this is what we do, this is what we do well, this is the region we cover. Um, always looking to expand that. We've got groups that do safe rooms. We've got groups that do alarms and integrations. , we've got groups that'll do, , you know, a more complex, complicated, , installation, , around biometrics and, , perimeter sensors. So, , yeah, we'd love to see, , greater partnering and networking and, and we're often at, at some of these conferences, you can find us out there as well.

Ron:

Yeah. Um, I've got your website pulled up here. Um, , actually let me, let me put it across, , the screen here, , because I wanna pivot. I am gonna ask you one more. , I might feel, some might feel I'm going sci-fi, but anyone that knows me won't be surprised by my question. , but let, let me get this up on screen here.

Kris:

Yeah. While you're, you're touching on that. I mean, the integrators that we deal with, you know, have got, , a lot of experience in these areas. They're, they've really built in robust programming because we all know, right? It's the 3:00 AM phone call that says, you know, the, the AV went out in the house, or I can't get into my, , PlayStation. The kids are trying to play, there's a sleepover and none of it's working and. There's a million things that can go wrong in a complicated house with regard to av it, , devices, you know, all the different, um, systems. And so if you can have a user experience as a, as an integrator vendor, um, that is really critical. Um, because you won't survive the first lack of service, right? The first fail in service. I mean, we've lived it, right? Like, oh yeah, you guys didn't respond at three in the morning when this wasn't working. And you know, who else is there out there to do that? And from a security perspective, what we're looking for is we can't, we can't ever fail. Like the bad guys only need to be successful once, they only need to defeat your system once. But from our perspective, we can never fail. Like we can't afford one. And that's a really important thing for the, the integrators and the design teams that are out there that are listening.

Ron:

So I have an opinion, Chris. Alright. Alright. So my opinion is that we know that this AI wave is happening. It's happening right now, and these, this AI wave is we're approaching, , a GI and, , and soon A-S-I-A-S-I is where the, the AI has super intelligence. It's smarter than the humans. And the next form factor of that, that. Technology and that intelligence is into the, the robot, the humanoid robot. , there's dozens and dozens of vendors across the world making these humanoid robots. They're, they're, right now, they're pretty advanced, 2, 20, 25. Mm-hmm.

Ron:

And, , they're going to likely do nothing but continue to advance, , likely at an exponential rate. And so my theory is, , and this, what I'm about to say is not a stretch. These are very soon gonna make their way into the homes of ni high net worth customers. , my, , my assumption is I think that that might happen through the technology contracting channel that, , we work today. I think that this is, it's not a stretch to say that humanoid robot, , could be a product line or a service line that the integrator is offering their customer. You could argue that, that that , intelligence, that that robotic form factor is an interface type to control the home, right? Because you could

Ron:

talk to it and it likely will be tapped into the network of the home and it will be able to, you know, you'll tell your robot butler to turn all the lights off or on, or set a scene. There's no restriction why they couldn't go as you command and your lights change or your shades drop or your theater or your AV turn on.

Kris:

Yep.

Ron:

You are with me so far. If I said anything that seems outland, you've

Kris:

got the armless and legless phone right now, right? It's a version, simple version. It's, keep going. I'm with you. I'm tracking. Alright,

Ron:

so you're, you're, you're walking down the path with me, so I am now, now I'm gonna go dark sci-fi. You now have a humanoid form factor, which is stronger as strong as a human. Stronger than a human inside of a home. And, , , bad things could happen if that went sideways. I'm curious. , I I, I'm gonna try to form a question out of that. I just really, I had fun getting my hypothesis out there. Yeah, that's good. ,

Ron:

But in your domain, this is gonna be an element that you're gonna have to start fielding, I'm imagining if you aren't already planning for it. You know, I was, , just before we went live, I had done the, the research. I remember seeing in the news that Elon Musk is gonna make his $1 trillion pay package if he can produce 1 million, , humanoid robots in the next 10 years. And, , and that's just one vendor Right? Exactly. Of dozens of vendors. I was, , watching Moonshots just recently, and they had, , they, they were talking to the, the CEO and founder of one X Robots. , which are humanoid robots with a soft exterior, so you can give them a hug. But, , I thought that was cute, but it's just, it's mind boggling how advanced these robots are becoming. Yeah. What are your thoughts on the subject?

Kris:

Yeah. , so to recap, you're gonna have a highly capable, highly authorized mobile, um, trusted, um, device inside your home. , to your point, may or may be stronger than a human being. Um, may be able to imitate human beings in a lot of ways. Um, and probably built with an open architecture, digital architecture that allows, you know, configuration, programming and integration with a lot of different devices. Mm-hmm. Um. What could go wrong? What could go wrong? What could go wrong? Right. Um, I mean, we've all seen Blade Runner, right? You know, that, where that ended up as a dystopian future with, with, , the replicants running around. And, , and I, and I think we've all seen the upside, you know, the other positive views of robotics and humanoid robotics.

Ron:

I told my wife it could do the laundry. She got very excited. She had me show her a video. I was like, there it is. It's doing the laundry. It folded the laundry. She's like, when can we have one?

Kris:

Yeah, no, there you go. I remember when I was at CIA now, many years ago, they had robots, , mowing the lawn. And this was, this is, man, we're going back, you know, 15 years. Wow. Um, which was fantastic. And at the time we, you know, we all marveled at these guys running around the courtyard, you know, keeping the greens looking good. But yeah, I mean, you're talking about now you're applying a number of security elements. To what you would apply to a home management system, smart home. You're applying a number of security elements to what would be an insider threat. Concern. Yeah. Like a human being, like a, an estate manager, a butler, a nanny that would have trusted access and authority to do certain things. Can, can, is really the core of a insider threat program. You need to, you need to make sure that they are trusted, you make sure they are doing the things they should be doing and not doing things that shouldn't. So you're gonna have to apply insider, insider threat sort of protocols to a humanoid robot with all those kinds of authorities and trust. So, , yeah, it's squarely in our space, it'd be squarely in the integrator space. , how do we do this? Right? Um, and we've all seen the sci-fi movies where they go bad, right? The, the, the robot goes bad, you know, even that one, , , sentient. Life form an alien. Right? Going back to Bishop.

Ron:

Oh yeah.

Kris:

Um, now we're, now we're going back ways. Going back to aliens. That's definitely thing. Yeah, exactly.

Ron:

We're dating ourselves.

Kris:

Yeah. A hundred percent. Yeah. No, it's, it's a, it's a really brave new world with some really interesting opportunities out there. Um, and I, we've had clients already that we've got the Boston Dynamics dogs, you know, running around the properties and you, it's a camera. Are, are you doing

Ron:

security surveillance like cameras? Yeah. Know, responding to

Kris:

perimeter stuff on the perimeter and, you know, drones are similarly capable, you know, or drones being deployed to respond to a perimeter alert. , sure. Launching, going out there, they can get there faster. In some instances. They can give a better information, , perhaps thermal imagery. Very quickly on a, on a distant perimeter as opposed to trying to deploy somebody on a, on a, , a TV or something to get out there and figure out what it is. And it's a, it's a resource saver, it's a time saver. , you probably get perhaps better assessment in a more timely fashion in those kind of instances. But again, there's, there's restrictions, like weather may be a problem. , there could be issues with, um, connectivity. You know, we've gotta, you've gotta maintain the wifi connection or the RF connection. So there's, there's always challenges. But as we're seeing, this stuff is exponentially advancing. Our world.

Ron:

I, I think that that maybe a summary there is your, your role in the life of these customers is going to, , do nothing but maybe continue to accelerate, , versus, you know, decline.

Kris:

Yeah. The world is getting more chaotic, , more interconnected, more hypermobile than we've ever been before as a society. Um, with that comes risk at every turn. And so how can we help our clients make great decisions with better intelligence, better analysis, , on a, on a more 24 7 consistent basis, like on call, I mean, we are highly responsive. We have extremely high integrity. We offer excellent services. Um, all those things you would want, , from a, a general contractor of risk, right? To help you and a family or a corporation to, to manage this, not only today, but over the horizon.

Ron:

Makes sense. You are wearing a shirt that says Fox, Bravo, overland. That's true. Yep.

Ron:

, you, you and I were just, , , in a catch up call just actually recently just, just kind of kept seeing how each other was doing, and you were telling me about this, and I was like, man, I absolutely wanna share this with my, , with my, my folks that tune into the show. So, te tell us, you are the executive director, , what's the mission behind FBO?

Kris:

Fox? Provo. Overland, thank you, , for that. And yeah. Fox Provo Overland is an, an overland organization, nonprofit 5 0 1 C3. We're based out of Texas and our goal is to use over landing, to take veterans and first responders on a journey, , that helps transform them, , and take them to a better place than they've been. So all of our. Veterans and first responders have been negatively impacted by stress by, you know, PTSD in some instances by, um, injuries that they may have sustained during service. Um, and all of that drives, um, stressors, drives isolation, it drives, um, sort of a degradation of life, , for these veterans and first responders, , and all to different degrees. Um, we understand that, um, they're both in a very similar space. Veterans go out on deployments and they have high stress environments. They come back, they have to reintegrate back into the civilian world that doesn't understand them. Our first responders, whether they're EMTs, police, federal law enforcement, state, local. Firefighters, they all are dealing with stress every day. They're responding to emergencies on a daily basis. So that acute, long-term chronic stress has a negative impact on, on their, the quality of life. So what Fox, Bravo, Overland does is we take veterans and first responders, we take them on overlanding expeditions, and we get them outdoors and we get them among their peers, and we get them in an environment where they can regain a sense of purpose, they can vent, they can, they can have sort of peer counseling experiences with, in a safe space about what they've been through in their, in their life and what they're going through now. Um. Frankly, it's a transformation through adventure. We get them out there, we put 'em on red team, and red team is gonna try to go from point A to point B, and they're gonna maneuver through this beautiful, you know, mountainous region. We've selected for this trip in Utah or Arizona, Colorado, wherever, Arkansas. And the thinking is that they, they are able to, in a nonclinical environment, engage with their peers and find sort of regain purpose, , combat the isolation that they may have been experiencing. Um, and then ideally they bring that home, right? So they do a, a 10 day expedition with us. They're like, wow, I, I've, I feel better about life. I feel better about my colleagues. I feel better about myself. I want to get back engaged in the workforce. I want to. Maybe, you know, be a better husband, be a better wife, be a better spouse, partner, whatever it is. And, and ideally in the long run, we're having secondary and tertiary positive effects. You know, we're, we're in theory, we're helping that family have a higher quality of life. The kids have a higher quality of life, perhaps we're helping to combat suicidality among veterans and first responders. And we've had testimonials specifically to that. Um, so it, it's a peer counseling kind of, , outdoor therapy, , experience. And we do a number of expeditions each year. We bring participants in, they get to participate at no cost. We raise the funds, we pay for everything. We organize the, the trips. Um, in a lot of instances, they're able to cover their flight, you know, to the, to the location of their airfare. And that's fine. If, if they can't, we'll cover that too. Um, but they, , they arrive, they're assimilated into the team. Um, they now are experiencing things like they did when they were in service. You know, like on red team working with a team of seven or eight individuals trying to achieve a certain goal. And, , we do 10, 10 day expeditions. , we move overland. And, and overland is different than off-roading, if you will. Right. So let's, let's talk about overlanding. Overlanding is moving purposefully from point A to point B on what may be an unimproved , path, a road trail, whatever it is. And the objective is to get from point A to point B. . Achieve your mission and preserve your vehicle. Like we're not racing from A to B and just trying to get there at all costs. And, and this, this has been around a long time, you know, the, the Camel Trophy, you know, , challenges that are out there. There's a variety of, , challenges around the Rubicon Trail. There's a variety of challenges around Trek and the, the Land Rover environment, , that industry. Um, but what we are doing is taking them from point A to point B and allowing them to just get better. If you really boil it down to what they're doing, they're among their peers and they're getting better in an outdoor environment. So when we, when we stop at these camps, we're able to do challenges, we'll do competition. So now Red Team is competing against Blue Team, and now there's a little bit of competition and, and can't imagine that would ever happen amongst a group of veterans or first responders. , but we're doing, you know. And we're not doing complicated stuff. This isn't, you know, , the old eco challenge or, , um, any of those dramatic, dangerous competitions. We're, we're doing darts, we're doing archery, we're doing firearms marksmanship, we're doing fire starting, um, ax throwing land and kind of like

Ron:

survival, life skill. Yeah. Fun and type of activity. And

Kris:

everybody can do it, right? Everybody can do all of those. None of these are really heavily fitness oriented, obviously gender neutral. Everybody can ride in a truck, everybody can camp, everybody can be in our groups. Um, we, we can support everybody from the perfectly capable even,

Ron:

, crutches or wheelchair bound. Wheelchair

Kris:

bound. Yeah. We've got all kinds and, and all manner of veterans and first responder, , with all kinds of challenges and we're able to support all of them. So, um.

Ron:

How did you become, how did this happen? I, I mean, I'm curious. Yeah. Um, I mean this is, , obviously, , impressive and, , so desperately needed. Our, our first responders and our, our warriors come back and, you know, the little I know is that it seems society doesn't do a great job to support them.

Kris:

Right.

Ron:

And we could do better. And that sounds like your effort is, you're trying to do your piece of doing better. How did this come about? How did it form?

Kris:

Yeah. I wasn't the founder. Um, I was, , I was a, , somebody who benefited along the way. So I mean, Greg Walt and Paul Zabell are two, you know, founders back in 2011 were Iraq and Afghanistan veterans, and they were also FBI agents at the time. And so they were experiencing both sides of that coin of stress, and they found themselves in. San Francisco and they were like, we need to get out, we need to get away from society. We've gotta just cope with some of the stuff we're dealing with. And they thought, let's just take some friends and let's go up in the Sierra Nevadas and let's just have a good time. And they also were into these four by four vehicles, um, and they found themselves doing a trip and then doing another trip and let's invite some other veterans and first responders. And it sort of built, so starting back in 2011, um, they were doing this for fun, um, and. It grew over time and they started inviting some of their, their, , friends and colleagues from, , some of their deployments. So they were inviting, you know, , British and Kiwis and Norwegians and, , Australians and all these other veterans and first responders. They were meeting overseas during their deployments and they'd stayed in touch, like, Hey, how would you like to come over to the United States and experience this? And then I learned about it, , at Red Five, and these were my, my FBI swap buddies that were doing this. And they were like, Hey, would you mind, you know, donating something and helping us, you know? And I'm like, yeah, what do you need? And they're like, oh, how about water bottles? You know, I mean, we were thinking big back in the day, right? So water bottles and write me a hundred dollars check. And so we, we went in, you know, heavy early and, , as did some other companies and, and I was. It was a great idea. And I, and I hadn't really been involved in the overlanding environment, and I was no longer in the, in the San Francisco area, so I wasn't really as connected as I used to be. But, um, they kept doing it. And so, and then COVID was a disruptor, right? But they, they came right back, did it again, and then 23, they're like, Hey, you should go on a trip. And I'm like, you know, I, I probably should. Let's go. You know? And I was thinking, I'm just gonna volunteer. I'm gonna, you know, I'm gonna cook, I'm gonna clean the camp, I'm gonna help move water, fuel, whatever you need. And then, , Greg said, Hey, yeah, we, we, , we had a team leader drop out. Do you want to come up and help you drive a vehicle? And sort of, you know, run a group through this and I'll do anything. Right? Let's go. Anything to help this group. And what I found out, , Ron, was that I had no idea how badly I needed this. , what was fascinating was that I had missed the team effort. The team camaraderie and the cohesion and the trust that we had in our teams, whether it was SWAT or counter assault or you know, FBI or, or the veterans I worked with overseas. I missed that desperately and I missed the ability to talk about stuff. You had bottled it up desperately. Oh yeah. You

Ron:

packed it down deep

Kris:

and you know, and you, you think, oh, well you're running a company, right? You've got your team, you've got your tribe, you're doing your thing. But, you know, at the top, it's, it's hard to have that camaraderie only at the top. Yeah. And, , so I, I found myself, you know, at the end of that trip just going, what have I been doing that I missed all this? And then there was a couple other peers, , on the trip that were not veterans, but were first responders. Um, a British friend of mine now, um, Pete, and he had sort of shared the same thing, like we were trying to figure out if we were really included as first responders and not veterans. And the reality was we're all feeling the same stuff. Mm. And he had shared the same kind. , revelation he had had, , working in the, in the British law enforcement realm that yeah, once he left the service, he was like lost. And there was nothing to really help transition to this new environment in this civilian world. And our veterans experienced that as well. They'd come back from a, a deployment or they, they drop off a, a 10 year or 20 year career and they're dropped into a completely new environment with less than ideal support. And it's not that the VA or, or some of these other groups don't do, don't provide help, right. But we know that they can't possibly do it all. And what refining is that those groups are struggling to keep up with the needs of veterans and first responders. And as an FBI agent, , so, so many of our friends and colleagues, specifically on the SWAT teams and, and in some of the other, um, what you call the other duties within FBI have actually committed suicide as well. We're having a lot of suicide in the FBI and, and law enforcement in general. So there's a lot of depression. There's a lot of isolation. Amongst both our veterans and first responder groups. And then I'm like, all right, so I did my first trip. This is great. Um, let's go on the second trip. And so it was a shorter trip. It was, we're going to Big Bend, , state Park in Texas. So I was able to go on that trip and learned a lot and, , have great memories from that trip. Big Bend, shorter trip. So different kind of concept. , and then they're like, Hey, you know, let's go do a bigger trip. And then I had, then I caught the bug and we all talk about drinking the Kool-Aid or being bitten by the bug. And now you gotta find a truck, build a truck, and, and take a truck on the trail. Have you bought a truck?

Ron:

Built a truck and taking it on the trail?

Kris:

Yes. , tell us about the truck. It's an illness. , and I'm sure the guys will be laughing when they read. They see this and, and it, everybody does it. It, it's just kinda where we go. But yeah, so I was a, a, a Land Rover fan, so I went down the Land Rover path and the purists will say that that's not the path. It's the Toyota, that's the, the purest path of overlanding. The, the Land Cruisers and the um, the Tacomas and the forerunners and all that. But we've got the, I've got a 21 defender, um, and then Greg came out to DC and helped me build it out. , and added all the, tell me

Ron:

about building it outer. What does that, what does that mean?

Kris:

It's horrifying. If you've never done it, um, you know, you're looking at this power drill and like, I'm gonna drill into the side of this vehicle. And it's a, it's a, it's a perfectly

Ron:

good vehicle that you're about to start drilling into. Yeah. And

Kris:

you know, and I don't, I don't, I didn't have any experience in doing this. And it, and it was funny 'cause I was talking to the. The guy on the trip, and I'm like, you need your teammate to give you the confidence to do this. And that was one of the things that, you know, my, my teammates gave me is like, Hey, it's, you're gonna, you know, and it's dumb as it sounds. It's like, Hey, I've never been a guy to drill a hole in the roof of the truck. You know? It just didn't make sense. It's not the, it's like jumping out a perfect airplane. Most people

Ron:

listening, it probably never drilled a hole in a roof of a vehicle. Right?

Kris:

Right. Because guess what? It's gonna leak, right? Why would you ever do that? But now we're gonna take care and we're gonna, we're gonna do it right, and we're gonna plan, and we're gonna measure twice, cut once, and we're gonna, you know, put, put the gear on and we're gonna seal it correctly. And it's gonna work. And it's gonna be an enhanced functionality for your truck, whether you're running, you know, adding a radio and an antenna, a roof rack, , a winch on the front, or you know, protection armor for the vehicle, whatever it is, and, and electronics. Are you kidding me? What are we doing messing with electronics and vehicles today? But again, working with a teammate? To me, it, it enabled me to achieve the goal because I had someone who knew what they were doing, who was teaching me, walking me through this process of how to, how to add additional things to the vehicle so that it would be more functional in the wild. And that to me was, was, , strangely emotional, , to be able to do that. Something I'd never been able to do before. And then now I'm taking it out there and people are like, oh, it's, you know, you're running it to Starbucks and back. And the reality is, no. I, we we're taking these trucks on these trips. , we're doing the Continental Divide. Does your truck have a name? Northern Arizona? Yes. So as you can imagine with, , with, with the alphas that we run with men and women there, a lot of names get thrown out. , for, for better and worse. We all have very thick skin, , and are are eager to beat each other up. Um, but they also know that I've got a, , so fin Affinity with, , the Star Wars. Jargon. And so when I showed up at the Black Land Rover Defender with everything on it blacked out. It was immediately named Vader. I love it.

Kris:

Um, so it is, it is Vader. Um, you'll see the writeup on the Fox Bravo Overland website, but okay. Um, I was, I was taking people on trip and I gotta tell the story 'cause , yeah, Andre and Ben will kill me if I don't. But, um, I'm taking it on. We're going up Engineer Pass in Colorado and we're letting other people drive. Like, so this is the point, right, is we bring our trucks, but we trust the other Fox Bravo participants to drive the truck and get the experience. So we're going up engineer, making our way up, engineer pass. And it's slow going. And, you know, guys are nervous. Guys are driving their own, not their own vehicle up a very steep incline with high exposure. Thousands of feet drop off the left and right, and they're going slow and over landing is supposed to go slow, but in the, on the radio we hear Vader Vader, you gotta pick up the page. You're driving like Miss Daisy. So suddenly Vader has an alter ego of, of this, this flower, this daisy. And so it kind of stuck for the trip. And so, oh, that's great. We had to off time. You have a daisy now, , symbol on Vader. Exactly.

Kris:

Yeah. We got, , a little daisy on the back of Vader to, to recognize and honor the alter ego of, of yourself. You gotta

Ron:

have the ying to the yang. Most things you do,

Kris:

and you can't take yourself too seriously. Now. That's a whole part of the trip, right? You gotta be able to roll with all that kind of stuff. And that's the stuff we really missed.

Ron:

All right. I wanna put some visuals on the Sure. The screen for our, , our, our folks that are tuned in. I, I know you've got some, , a little bit of material here for us. Let's run through it. , and then let's talk about how anyone tuned in can help. Yeah, absolutely. I think what you're doing is the, the, the right things for the right reasons. But yeah, take, take us through it. , what I see on the screen is Fox, Bravo, overland, the power of comradery, comradery, resilience, and purpose.

Kris:

Yeah, absolutely. That is the core of, of who we are and what we're achieving. , we're trying to increase the comradery, , increase the resilience of our participants and then, , help them regain, , you know, purpose in life. And so what we're doing and really the why, right? The why of what we're doing it is, this is an impact slide that you're seeing. So since 2011, we've done 20 expeditions across the United States. We've had a, and we're on our 22nd as of today as we speak. Desert Fox, one of 2025 is on the trail as we speak today. , we've had 120 participants from the us, uk, north Zealand, and Norway. Um. In 2025, we actually, , secured our IRS, , accreditation as a 5 0 1 C3. And so we're starting to get grants, and I'm excited to talk about some of the grants that we're getting from some really good names. We're in conversations with, um, a couple of family foundations. We've had an initial conversation with Walmart Foundation. We're having really positive conversations with the Gary Sunis Foundation. They're all seeing what we're doing. We're seeing that it's different, and they're looking to help us and, and we're looking to continue those conversations. And again, a hundred percent no cost to the veterans and first responders that go on these trips. , we are seeing an impact, , with each of these, and the, and it, it really comes out in the, in the testimonials that we're hearing, right? So the testimonials very important. You know, the group has had an incredible impact on my mental and physical wellbeing, wellbeing. , Mary was one of our, our participants coming over from overseas. Um, the two trips I've taken are life changing, um, challenged physically and mentally in the open with others who share the unique bond of military and law enforcement is truly irreplaceable. And then, , I think one of the bigger ones that we've all all cherish is, is James who talked about how we helped him reengage with life and he's, we helped him, you know, avoid a couple of suicide attempts. And that's, that is if we save one Ron. Yeah. Everything we've done is worth it. Amen. If we can help one veteran, one first responder, reengage in the, in the world, it's worth it.

Ron:

I agree.

Kris:

It's worth it. So, really important stuff for us. And, and I think, you know, we often joke, you know, these trucks save lives, right? We put these, we put these men and women in these trucks and they're out there on the trail and, and it's the trucks that save the lives because they are the. The, , the vehicle, , to transform, , these lives, , through adventure. So, you know, how can, how can people help, how can listeners help? We're really looking for corporate sponsorships at this point. We have a great grassroots fundraising. , we've, we've raised more through grassroots in 2025 than we've ever raised before. Very proud of that. In our first year, , I think we're about to break through with a couple large grants, so I'm excited about those. But corporations can make a difference, you know, and as we come to this end of the fiscal year for many into the calendar year, for some, if corporations are looking to, you know, sponsor or donate gift, , sponsor an expedition, sponsor a truck, um, provide scholarships for a dozen veterans and first responders to go on a trip, um, that's what we're looking for, that kind of interaction because it's a force multiplier of our mission. Individual gifts, we love them. We'll take 'em all day. Everybody knows a veteran or a first responder that needs help. Um, so we'd love to have that. And obviously you can, , get in touch with us if you want to donate, you know, water, fuel gear, , in kind donations go a long way. A lot of these folks travel a long way, and they don't, you know, they, they can't check all their camping gear. And we need, we need to keep our gear, , cache, , full of quality gear for them. And then if someone wants to, you know, run an auction, do a fundraising, , drive or, or help us just with outreach through social media campaigns, we'll take that help all day. , we're not too proud to take all the help and learn in this new process. , but it's, it's really, , and I would direct them to the Fox Bravo, Overland website. There's a donations page, , that, that is the easiest way to find us and to donate. Um, but we're, we're on the verge of a, a new. Sponsorship, if you will, that will sponsor an entire expedition, um, with the co-branding, co-marketing with the donor, , which is gonna be a fantastic thing. , what are

Ron:

the denominations, just so that folks have an understanding, Chris, of the type of funding that it's, it's you're, you're aspiring, , to receive and, and maybe paint the picture of vision of where you want to go with the, the gaining of additional funding. Like where, where do you want to go with this?

Kris:

Yeah. Where we want to go with this really is, um, we wanna continue the grassroots. So it's really three pronged attack on the fundraising efforts. So continue the grassroots, continue the social media, you know, we'll take the $5, the $10, who do you know, , the roundup at the point of sale, right? We'll take all of that, 'cause that all adds up. Um, we are getting more and more in the 5,000 to $20,000 donation range on a, on a more regular basis. Those are. Dramatic, , amplifiers of our mission. Um, you know, the moonshot, the growth budget that we wanna manage to is really where we're trying to build out the quarter million, the 500,000, the million dollar donations that would, that would really fuel an endowment that makes Fox, Bravo really, , persistent. And it's not gonna go away. And the mission can endure beyond me or beyond Greg or Paul or any of our teams.

Ron:

When you were able to form an endowment, you now can fund the operations out of the interest

Kris:

that's exactly on that

Ron:

endowment,

Kris:

correct? Yep. And we learned that from some of our recent conversations. Like, you need to be pursuing that and then your overhead and GA are covered by the interest. Um, and then you're really just raising for an expedition or raising for a specific activity. And, and the expeditions aren't. The only thing we do, and I'll just add these on here, is we're trying to build workshops and build like a little bit of a, a mechanical academy of sorts. Smaller events because people may not want to go on a trip,

Ron:

right?

Kris:

You know, veterans first respond like, Hey, I can't, I don't want to, I don't have the time, but can you come over and, and work on a truck for a day? You know, can you come over and help us, you know, um, upgrade a truck that's being built for the team. Um, whatever it might be. , could you help us on a support, in a support role, a logistics, , shipping stuff out for trips? Um, we've got a number of, , , volunteers that go on and just cook. Cookie, my hat's off to you. We'll, we'll see you on the trail soon. Um, but, um, this guy, never a veteran, never a first responder, but he is, he is on as many trips as he can go, and he, he takes care of us with, , food and a service attitude that you cannot beat. Wow. Um, so those kinds of stories and those kinds of support element and activities are, are above and beyond, you know, the, the expeditions themselves. So we're trying to do more. And then for those that are like, Hey, you're taking a four-wheel drive vehicle out on a trail, I, I just wanna put out there that part of the things that we do on our trips as we talk about, um, conservation, we talk about the tread lightly principles, and we leave no trace. So we're on a trail and we're on a national wilderness or a wildlife refuge. Um, our goal is that they never knew. You never know we were there, right? So we pack it in, we pack it out, we don't disturb, you know, natural, , you know, , scenery and wildlife. We stay away from all that. And the reality is that, , we do a lot of trail cleanup, , when we're on the trail and we like to pack out more trash than, than stuff we brought in. So I want to just, just reinforce that, 'cause we've got a, , a couple of grants that have come in that really are around some of those elements of, of service as well.

Ron:

Chris, what if, what if there are people in the lives of those that are listening that they think might be potentially a good fit for a trip like this? What, what is the process there? Are you seeking attendees or participants in the, in the program?

Kris:

Yeah, that is, that is the second big goal, right? So one is we have to have the fundraising to service those veterans and first responders. And we wanna make sure that we are keeping the funnel full of qualified applicants. And so we've got a, , a clinical psychologist on our team and he helps us build out the screening protocols. 'cause we do wanna make sure that everyone who goes on a trip is in a good place. Um, you know, whether in part of their recovery, part of their current lifestyle, are they in a good place to go on a trip that's off grid, hundreds of miles from, you know, civilization, if you will. And we have to make sure that that's a safe environment for them and for everyone else on the trip. Um, we're all going through a variety of different things and you know, so we have a, a very, very rigid, um, policy around, um, code of conduct on the trips and things like that. So the applicants have to go through a screening process. They have to be selected and then they have to agree to come. And then obviously we, we can cover the costs. And then though they agree to follow the code of conduct, which is really important. And so, yeah, veterans and first responders is what we're looking for. And you could apply through the website as well. And what we find is, um, there are some self sort of created barriers, , to wanting to go on a trip. We often hear, um, you know, someone else needs it more than I do. You know, and that was kind of, that was kind of me, right? Like, I, I don't need that kind of peer therapy. I don't need that kind of experience. And the reality was I needed it more than I could ever know. Um, but there's always the veteran, the first responder, like, someone else needs it more than I need it, so I'm not gonna go on the trip, right? And so we try to debunk that myth pretty quick. Like, Hey, just go, go on a trip. Commit, let's go do two, you know, 10 days, , on a trip and find. What it means to you. And what we find are that the men and women have been on the trips are the, the biggest evangelists of the experience. And it's hard to, hard to capture a, , a physical and emotional experience in text and in still photos. And I mean, you know, better than anybody on the, on the marketing front, how hard that is to do. Yeah. And so, um, we would try to help them over, you know, I've got this physical challenge, like I'm in a wheelchair, or I, um, I've lost a limb in combat, or whatever it is. Right? So we can accommodate all that. So we try to debunk that too. Like, come with us. We, I mean, and. We've had, we've had vendors, , donate tracked wheelchairs. So we've got, you know, a participant, you know, cruising around the campsite in what is like a, a mini tank version of wheelchairs. I thought I

Ron:

saw a picture. I was cru on the website. I was like, that looks like a tank.

Kris:

It's, it's, it's the best. Right? And now you've given this person even more mobility than they had before, and that's, that's fantastic. Yeah. So, and, and then I think, um, , just life gets in the way. Right? You know, family job, I can't get away for this, I can't get away for that. So we're trying to, we're always looking for new ways to reduce that barrier, , to the veterans for like four days longer weekend trips as opposed to always attend day expedition. You know, the challenge is it's almost that fourth day where they let their guard down. They're starting to now interact with their peers, and they're starting to really, you know, reap the benefits. So sometimes a four day trip is not quite as beneficial as we'd like, but still. Anytime you can get a veteran first responder outdoors and engaging in nature. Yeah, I mean, there are dozens of studies that show that that is major health benefits. Um, and so yeah, I would encourage if you know someone who needs a trip, a veteran or first responder, please encourage them to apply. We're shooting for four, maybe five expeditions next year. , we had a waiting list for this year, which is fantastic. Um, and so we'll try to roll those over into 26. But, , and the registration

Ron:

for the, , people to attend is, is right This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it..

Kris:

That's right. Yep. Okay. Yep. And, , we usually put out a call for applicants typically in the beginning of the year and start collecting, , those applications for, for screening. And then they go through the process and then they're advised when they're selected. Then they're assigned a team leader. And then team leader makes sure they get everything they need to, to successfully go through the trip. And it's sort of their, their sort of mentor guide for the, for the duration of the expedition. And then on the back end, we're building a digital community. So, you know, the experience doesn't stop and the expedition rolls, you know, onto pavement and, and puts it in park. Um, the experience then is now they're engaged with 120 plus of their peers. And we're getting the phone calls at three in the morning. Like, I'm in a bad place today. I just need to talk to one of my Fox Bravo brethren. And so we're on the phone talking 'em through whatever they're going through. Right. And that's huge that that ongoing digital community and these alumni trips that we're running are, are the continuation of the, the, the peer counseling and the outdoor therapy and the brotherhood that, that we've created and sisterhood we've created within Fox Bravo.

Ron:

Chris, it's awesome what you're doing. , I'm proud of you, proud of all the people that are, , assisting you. I know you can't do it alone. There's a large team behind you that's helping you. Huge team.

Kris:

Yep.

Ron:

Make that happen. , thank you so much my friend, for coming back on Automation Unplugged and, and sharing and, , I, I always learn when I, when I get to spend time with you, whether we're recording a podcast or we're just catching up. So, yeah, appreciate you being you and, , taking time with us today,

Kris:

Ron. This is hugely valuable to us. , Fox. Bravo. I hope you find, , , the, the earlier part of this helpful to your listeners are on the automation side, and, and we're, we're a big fan of, , all those out there. Thank you for this generous, , airtime for Fox. Bravo, Overland.

Ron:

You are welcome, my friend. All right folks, make sure to reach out. Fox Bravo overland fb overland.com. . Take a donation and, , if you have someone in need, reach out. Maybe this, , would be just what the doctor ordered. All right. All, , we're, we're gonna release this show right before Christmas. , so I wanna say Merry Christmas. Happy Hanukkah. Happy holidays to everybody. Happy holidays,

Kris:

everybody. Merry Christmas. Yep.

Ron:

And, , we'll, we'll, we'll see you all soon. Take care.

Kris:

Thanks.

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Ron Callis is the CEO of One Firefly, LLC, a digital marketing agency based out of South Florida and creator of Automation Unplugged. Founded in 2007, One Firefly has quickly became the leading marketing firm specializing in the integrated technology and security space. The One Firefly team work hard to create innovative solutions to help Integrators boost their online presence, such as the elite website solution, Mercury Pro.

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Resources and links from the interview:

• • Kris Coleman LinkedIn Profile Page

• • Fox Bravo Overland LinkedIn Profile Page
    
    
• • Fox Bravo Overland Webpage